Burning Wheel Is The Best Comedy Game On The Market & That Is Not A Joke (retropost)

Usually on Retropost Weekends I put up a post that's old and didn't get read that much because it, too, was put up on a weekend. This time, however I thought I'd put up one that actually got passed around quite a bit. Because it's funny.

Also note, playing Burning Wheel wrong was so fun we kept doing it for like 3 more sessions.

Original post below:

Note: Oh dear, somehow this has gotten linked to a Burning Wheel forum under the heading "

D&D With Porn Stars Plays BW...and it didn't go so well"

...which I find baffling. Other than the internet connection cutting out at the end, it went fine and was fun.

Unsurprisingly, the same thing happened when we played 4e--I said it was fun and I would like to play again and some kind of internet brain damage kicked in and people read it as "it wasn't fun and I won't play again". People are dumb as toast.

So we tried Burning Wheel*

*(What is that? An arty version of D&D that a guy wrote...Ok, anyway...)

(Harald) GM: So there's a village and the Duchess is sending you out because there are demons there and it's disrupting the trade route...

Zak (Sorceress): So wait, she's worried about it disrupting trade but not about like all these villagers?

GM: Well, you know she's a Duchess and so is above the hoi polloi and she doesn't really care but...

Cole (Elf): Does that trigger my elven Grief that she's so callous to the plight of these poor villagers?

GM: You could roll for Grief if...

Z: Well what if I like say to the Duchess like, hey, you gotta kinda y'know wink wink like you're really worried about these poor orphans because, these elves, they're sensitive...

GM: Well she has some Falsehood, so... (roll roll) Ok, you are convinced it's all about the orphans and their plight. Is there anything else you want to do before you go?

(Mandy) Dwarf: Yeah I need a grappling hook.

Z: Yeah, aaaand a grappling hook, and a net and a rope and...

C: And lard! I heard you humans have uses for this substance.

Z: Yeah we need lard.

GM: Well this would be a resources check...

Z: Well I got zero.

C: Me too.

M: Me too.

Z: Yeah and there's like 3 circles for debt and taxes and...

GM: Well you can try to get someone to lend you the money...

C: I have Oratory--Can I like make a speech in the public square urging the citizenry to fund our expedition?

Z: We can help if we have related skills, right? I have Rhetoric, I'll be like "make aaaaan...Ethical Appeal aaaand...an Argumentum Ad Demonium and...Oh and I have Falsehood, can I tell him to be like 'Oh this Sorceress' poor uncle was gnawed upon by demons...'

C: I can't lie or I'll become Sad.

Z: Fuck, Um, ok, I'll just lie and say my uncle was gnawed by demons and...

(roll roll)

C: Yeah, I see your crude falsehood and it makes me Sad.

Z:Fuck.

C: Anyway I make a speech.

Z: Tell them our Stretch Goal is a ten-foot pole.

C: 2 successes.

GM: Ok, well you get a rope and a big barrel of lard.

Z: Excellent! Dwarf: strap this barrel to your back it will amuse me.

M: I can roll it.

Z: Fine, roll it, like an ape.

C: Friends! I will carry the lard!

Z: Ok, you carry the lard, let's go. It's two days East, right?

GM: So, elf, you sing the Song of Paths?

C: Yes but I am really bad at it.

(roll roll)

C: Yeah, I uh...

Z: There's a Song?

GM: You're lost. Dwarf, sorceress, you see the elf is missing and there is a trail of lard...

D: We pursue him.

Z: Hey, guy, just go this way, ok. It's... How many suns are in this world?

GM: One.

Z: And it rises in the East and sets in the West?

GM: Yes.

Z: Ok, so yeah, friend Elf, simply walk away from your shadow in the morning.

C: Yes, well, in the land of Elfheim it is a perpetual dusky rose colored sunset so...

Z: Right, totally, I'll write you a new song, uh, it's called "Walk This Way".

GM: Is the song Beautiful?

Z: Wait, if it's Beautiful the Dwarf will like try to eat it, right because of Dwarven Greed right? It's not Beautiful.

C: Well I am learning in the human world that sometimes things are not Beautiful but they are Useful.

Z: Yeah, "Walk This Way" the song of the Arrowsmiths. It's not beautiful, it's just y'know, if you're driving a truck and it comes on the radio it keeps you awake.

C: We have no trucks in the Elven lands, we all ride on magic deers that...

Z: Yeah, I mean carts I mean...Anyway follow us.

C: Of course! Lead the way!

GM: Ok you come to near the village but you are not there yet because the elf got lost so you have to camp. And you see this most beautiful white deer you have ever seen...

M: I have to roll on Greed...

(roll roll)

M: I chase after it.

GM: What do you want to do with it?

M: I guess I want to...I want to chase it away from the demons.

GM: So you don't want to possess it?

M: Possess it?

GM: It runs off into the forest.

M: I pursue.

Z: I just, like facepalm while making breakfast.

C: Shall I retrieve him?

Z: Uh...that depends...is it gonna like give you a panic attack, friend Elf?

C: I will pursue! On my long and striding legs!

Z: Fucking nuthouse.

C: You do not seek to pursue and frolic with the beasts of the wild?

Z: Uh, you think he's, like, frolicking with it?

C: Of course! It is a magnificent beast! Hold, soon I'll return.

Z: Crom.

GM: Ok, you get the dwarf back and enter the village...

and then there were some villagers and they were lying and that made the elf Sad again and they tried to lock him in a closet and then we talked to a guy and then his wife stabbed him and Mandy tried to Persuade her to get off and I tried to add my Rhetoric Skill to that like "Hey, really get off" and some Prometheus goo came out of her nose and everyone was Shocked and then there was a bear with no eyes and then the G+ connection got all screwed up because Harald was in a hotel.
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Original post with hilarious comments here.
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A WHITE WOLF MYSTERYYYYY

So, yeah White Wolf released new Vampire rules & an adventure yesterday
and people started talking

What indeed?? They wondered

Across the web fans tried to figure out what White Wolf was getting at
with these grotesqueries

This, for example, really struck people as strange

(Something Awful's site replaces "fucking" with "loving" for some reason)

Here's the byline on the adventure.

That's the random encounter table in the Vampire adventure.

You might recognize this.

Oh here's a picture of Kenneth Hite from when we were in Sweden

Oh that's something Ken said once.

....about Vornheim

Oh and that's Martin's Facebook. He mentioned 2 days ago,
his home groups' still playing this campaign.

And here's Ken tweeting

Another fan theory.

Here's Martin being interviewed

Here's Martin talking more about what he plays at home

Oh here's a picture of me working  at the White Wolf Entertainment's table at the Indiecade
showcase at the E3 game convention this Wednesday next to a painting I did for them

"I think the controversy over what the R in OSR stands for is settled.
The R in OSR means "Fuck you, we won."
-James Edward Raggi, author of Lamentations
of the Flame Princess, May 24, 2017

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And now, a word from our sponsor:

Support Demon City by going here

Old-Schooling the World of Darkness

First off, I'll be repping White Wolf games tomorrow at the E3 game convention in LA at the Indiecade Showcase so if you're in town, come say hi. I might sign something if you're nice. Now, here's a decapitated body and a blog entry....

So somebody on my AskFM was like:

Ok, so, tips for making New World of Darkness more like Lamentations of the Flame Princess...:

1. Make sure they're fighting things that can kill them in like 2 hits

This is the most important thing. Fear of death keeps you paying attention, fear of death is the mother of invention.

Use fire, use silver, use magic, use bigger vampires, use whatever you have to use to make sure the players know if they mess this up there will be a consequence and that consequence will not be personally pleasant for the player. They will lose that character they spent all that time making. If they think that making a few tactical mistakes just leads to failing forward in a fascinating twist that extends the story then they have no real personal motive to try to figure out the right thing to do.

When Mario misses his jump, he dies. And starting over sucks, and that fear of the sucking makes it exciting.

2. Make sure they are weak, hunted and isolated, but have a chance to tear it all down

World of Darkness, of necessity, emphasizes whole shadow-civilizations of supernatural entities that have internal intrigue and culture, who have rules to help them get along with each other, who are more powerful than ordinary humans and know things the humans don't.

This can lapse into a situation where everything is fairly comfortable. It's like your real modern life, only better and you're a stylish predator.

Instead, try to think of ways to weaponize the entire contemporary environment against the PCs. Modern life should be an obstacle course of sunlight, video cameras, paranoia and, most of all, total failure to integrate with the existing spook-o-structure. If there's a Prince, that Prince wants you dead. They can have a clan, but there needs to be an overarching problem that cuts them off from easily relying on the rest of the clan.

On the other hand, don't go along with the default assumption that elders are impossible for thinbloods to kill. Just because you can't kill the dragon with your bare hands, doesn't mean there's no way to fuck the dragon up. You just have to be smarter and more resourceful.

3. Don't use the words

World of Darkness is full of words: The Hedge, Toreador, Sabbat. These contribute to the feeling that the dark places you are going are mapped and knowable and have been seen before and follow rules and aren't that big. Use as few as possible: if there's a wolf you don't want players going "Ah must be a gangrel!" just let them worry about the fact there's a fucking wolf trying to eat them and its drool burns like acid for some reason.

The worst part of any horror movie is all the parts after they explain where all the nightmare images are coming from--so skip that part. The young monsters won't want to use the same language as the old monsters anyway.

4. Making preying on humans hard

Maybe the humans are tough? Maybe the other monsters claim the humans? Maybe only certain humans will do? Maybe the right ones are hard to find?

Ordinary people shouldn't just be rations--or just background noise--they're treasure. Horrible, cursed treasure that you need to stay alive. Each attempt to establish a feeding ground or even to just escape their notice should in itself be an adventure.

And White Wolf's now-canonical "You are what you eat"-concept (the idea that powers come specifically from the kind and mental state of human you feed on) should help.

5. The story is that it's hard

You might think all this skulking and desperation might interfere with the story--but it won't, because the skulking and desperation is the story.

The characters can have all the nightclub orgies and velvet waiscoats they want--it's just they're going to have to fight for them this time. And get good at it.

6. Use historical and occult stuff

A big appeal of the World of Darkness is there's a dense mythology of hidden lore to uncover--a problem is that it can, again, familiarize that which, by nature, should be mysterious. 

The easy (or at least fun) fix for this is that there's an even denser and more hidden mythology of creepiness in the real world. 99% of human history involved people believing and acting on things on like they thought the sun was a god at war with the moon that was in turn a woman who hated babies. Here's a place to start down the click hole.

7. Actually be scary

While a vampire can drift toward people playing a game about being part of an idealized sexy ubermensch mafia family that accepts them even though they have anxiety attacks, if you want to do it DIY RPG style remember, it's a horror game. It's not just dark as in aesthetically, it's horror.

Like: horrifying things happen. The imagery and consequences of actions are horrible. Attempt to contemplate the truly unpleasant and then communicate it. This won't be the same for everyone, and hopefully you know your players better than I do.

There are some horror tips here.

8. PS There is actually a version of Vornheim re-written specifically for Vampire

A fan made it, it's here.

Support the game stuff here by giving to the Demon City Patreon here

Someone's Work

"'What are the Dvargir working towards? What is their plan?'

They are working to be working. Work is the plan. Work is the point."

--Veins of the Earth

So, hear me out on this one, I'll try to keep it short.

Three things happened this week--

First was a low buzz of back-and-forth emails and phone calls from different game companies that wanted me to work for them. The details kept being different, but the exchanges all had a theme: We'd love to work with you on x.

But then: if you would just agree to please compromise and make the game slightly worse.

I said "no" a lot. I would rather make the thing I wanted and believed in and would play myself for Patreon money than make a kind of wax-melted shape kinda like what I wanted for grown-up money (and trust me, you would rather I did it, too). But, yeah, it would've been nice.

The second was noticing an old 3.5 D&D era interview I'd saved on my hard-drive with Mike Mearls at D&D where they asked what he'd like to get rid of in the game and he just immediately shot out: "Bards". This is the best case scenario for a future in mainstream RPGs: you become the boss of the biggest RPG in the world and you still can't get rid of bards after two editions.

The third was more pleasant: I had my copy of Veins of the Earth and I was paging through it, just liking it, thinking how it had gone a step further than Fire on the Velvet Horizon--you got Scrap's art, which is trying to exist right on that line between acid scribble and awful primordial psychosis revelation, and then you've got Patrick's text, which is saying it's definitely awful primordial psychosis revelation, and then going one more than Velvet does by describing and quantifying what world is being awfully and psychotically revealed.

I won't, yet, probably, write that critical essay about The Epiphanic-Cthonic Theme in the Evolution of Scrap, or Patrick or Scraptrick--I'm too close to it, I've slept on her couch and I've gotten his Christmas presents--but my point here is: someone could.

Someone eventually might, because these things are piling up, and get interesting.

___

There is a body of work there--and you can talk about what is and isn't in it. As also there is a body of work for Noisms (you could write "Exoticism, Travel, and Alternate Etiquettes in the work of Noisms"), Jeff ( "Squeezing Minimalism: Enabling Creation Through Stupid"), and also for Michael Curtis, and James Raggi, and Rob Conley and lots of people I haven't read and don't know anything about and everyone else in independent games.

You could pick up the things they wrote and see something about them--and something about the medium, what is expressible in a game?

Now you could do that with any game thing, but in a lot of them you won't get too far, because you run into the problem I had with The Slaying Stone: How much of this was put here on purpose and how much of it had to be here because someone other than the author decide it did? Mearls can't even get rid of bards.

I have a lot of fun deep-diving old modules, and sometimes I think "Well why not take one of these authors and read that single author across companies, systems, settings and see what emerges?" and I try and it's boring and feels pointless and repetitive and reaching like trying to work up a psychological profile out of the way someone drives a bus route. Ah, they chose spiked clubs for the goblins instead of maces! See the way Bonner's imagination tends toward the perforative. There's so much crust on there.

You can do it with the early stuff from the first wave of inventors early on--Arneson, Gygax, Stafford, Jacquays, Ken St Andre, etc--there's a touch there, but after a while, in the second wave, even for very good writers, it stops being possible. With all the big and hyped properties there's a tremendous sense of What People Want. Even Vincent Baker, a tiny little cottage industry, has admitted to putting certain things in AW just so parts of the audience will complain about them and make a buzz.

I've been privy to some of the meetings: you really do have very good people, very smart writers, saying "Let's do this!" and someone else goes "Whoa, gorgeous!!!" and you really do have a guy going "The fans won't like that" and it doesn't get done. And so the thing gets crust on it. The most popular properties in RPGs now have decades of crust on them.

Many new mainstream properties crust instantly--a good writer pitches a game they'd never play at home using an existing formula or system, they write it completely competently, adding no new idea about what you could do in a game or help to run it, they're professional, they collect their check. They only ever play it ever again at cons. What's invented in the game is only what's necessary to shift it to the new genre.

The crust has benefits:

-There is a kind of crust that will allow you to create a buzz with existing fans of the property

-There is a kind of crust lets you sell things to children, or at least people who have them

-There is a kind of crust that lets you budget right, by letting you know how many copies of this kind of thing you will sell because it is like other things

-There is a kind of crust that lets you nab a big, licensed property, and give the people who like it what they expect

-There's a kind of crust that's cheap--it gets the book done on time and under-budget

...and if you're full-time in this business, those things have real benefits. I don't blame anyone for going that way if they have no other source of income, and those games have their uses.

However: it is a very different business and thing than the independent stuff most of DIY RPGland is making, and it is a different business than those early games.

DIY RPGers aren't just making a sort of lo-fi alternate version of what the mainstream RPG business is doing--you look at something like Veins or Broodmother Skyfortress and you see they're doing something that otherwise doesn't exist. Yes, there's monsters, yes, there's advice, but if you get to it after a stack of Pathfinder modules, you know you haven't seen a text that committed and that much itself and that much that suggests a new thing you, a person, could do in a long time. These are new kinds of books.

To be invited into a world by a person with a voice. To feel that voice telling you the story of that world, to see them use every tool in the book to try to get you to see that new world they way they do, to inject that world into your mind so that then putting your friends through it becomes second-nature, because it was luxurious and intimate to read and it was a real experience, so it's there, burned in like a Vancian formula, animated by its own energies.

I keep getting to write exactly what I want and draw exactly what I want and it is laid out exactly the way I think it should be--and that's not a very common experience in RPG land. Like them or not, when you buy these things coming out these days you are reading completely uncompromised expressions. Nobody in the credits of your deluxe mainline full-size hardcovers is doing that.

That's something that will die with us when we (with our perverse attachment to this stupid hobby) are gone. And we are only here because you specifically reading this happen to like this specific thing. This isn't a stage in some other process, this is it: these niche niche niche things are there and the only "up" the larger world will offer is a chance to do more compromised work.  The endgame isn't WOTC hires Jeff as creative director and he gets rid of bards, there won't be a live-action Veins of the Earth TV show on the BBC.

The things we're making here now? This is it, this is the thing the author wanted to make, and this is the strange economy that, strangely and probably temporarily, is supporting it. And it is better than what you'll get when they offer us a bunch of money. The Dvargir of DIY D&D don't leave the mines toward some above-ground apotheosis: this work is the plan, this work is the point.

So: support Yoon-Suin, support Veins and Broodmother, support James at LotFP and Hydra Co-Operative and, yeah, support Demon City and support everyone else doing this, and tell people you did and tell them about it. Because when you stop, it stops.

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