tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post8389150033864900099..comments2024-03-19T16:24:23.777-07:00Comments on Playing D&D With Porn Stars: "Deep"Zak Sabbathhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comBlogger40125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-34067085419751993372017-03-26T01:36:50.590-07:002017-03-26T01:36:50.590-07:00Public Public, you need to quote that proof now.
...Public Public, you need to quote that proof now.<br /><br />Again: we don't do half-conversations here.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-11828043403467845892017-03-26T00:36:11.065-07:002017-03-26T00:36:11.065-07:00They did but you didn't want to 'get it...They did but you didn't want to 'get it'. Every Comment A Poemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11202877276719861304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-57508153412437460682017-01-21T21:09:13.115-08:002017-01-21T21:09:13.115-08:00I really enjoyed this article.
"Here's ...I really enjoyed this article. <br /><br />"Here's a fact: how much artworks can say is largely an issue of how many questions you ask them."<br /><br />That's such a powerful idea expressed so simply and elegantly. Thank you for the read!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409859534659588182noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-81471710240976098172016-12-29T18:13:56.067-08:002016-12-29T18:13:56.067-08:00That was a wild ride. I will be e-mailing for it l...That was a wild ride. I will be e-mailing for it later.Verad Bellveilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06200642022404699056noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-3244922427617109912016-12-29T16:43:45.098-08:002016-12-29T16:43:45.098-08:00Note: a first-time commenter named " uncolobe...Note: a first-time commenter named " uncolober " left the following (stupid) comment here:<br /><br />"<br />With all due respect, these sentiments should only require about this much text to express:<br /><br />1. Regarding (a) relatability, (b) relevance and (c) sheer availability of life-experience schemata,<br />— Not everyone has experienced being an adult.<br />— Everyone has definitely experineced being a child.<br /><br />2. "Thought-provoking" (and its variants) is a buzzword and has a discussional value of such.<br /><br />"<br />...and then we had a long conversation where they admitted this wasn't true and committed several fact-checking errors and logical fallacies which s/he then failed to admit, moving goalposts repeatedly.<br /><br />As it was very long, had more factual errors than it is convenient to point out, not especially relevant to anything anybody else cares about and I don't think it's ok to host misinformation on the blog, I've deleted the whole thread.<br /><br />For a transcript, email me at zakzsmith AT hawtmayleZak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-59661891051814804052016-12-24T15:08:49.318-08:002016-12-24T15:08:49.318-08:00The defense of these games' content I've h...The defense of these games' content I've heard is more that you _experience_ the premise more and so might come to a more holistic understanding.<br />Like "telling" vs "showing" or "feeling". However I still think the behavior of every zealous indie fan I've ever met suggests the amount of enlightenment (even long term) that these games provide is exactly zero, as they are among the least empathetic, understanding, generous, thoughtful folks I've ever encountered.<br /><br />Whatever these games do, I will take on faith that they do it to some enjoyable degree to the target audience. I haven't seen evidence that would be accurately described as "Provokes thought" though. At least not:<br />-provokes unusual or even good thought<br />-to a degree any other RPG doesn'tZak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-38999904148351379922016-12-24T15:02:37.898-08:002016-12-24T15:02:37.898-08:00You mention the following:
"Are there adult...You mention the following: <br /><br />"Are there adults who would play Night Witches who were sexist before and decided not to be after?"<br /><br />This in the context of this essay clarified a problem I've been trying to articulate for some time in a number of games aligned with the storygame movement - they seem to be deep and often claim to be transformative experiences, but only to the people who already agree with the author going in. A group of players who don't are almost treated as an intrusion - I'm thinking of A Place To Fuck Each Other in particular on this point.<br /><br />My read on games like these is that they treat the elements they consider "thought-provoking" to be settled questions - not only settled, but self-evident, which differs from your stated awareness that people do have to go through a process of figuring out these questions over time. Why do you think these kinds of games still pay lip-service to the idea of a figuring-out process when they already seem to have a pre-determined answer players are supposed to reach?Verad Bellveilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06200642022404699056noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-81623582163762058992016-12-23T13:50:48.403-08:002016-12-23T13:50:48.403-08:00I apologize - I intended to respond to Charles'...I apologize - I intended to respond to Charles' comment.Danielle Ostermanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05688510764917107213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-53736686366878510792016-12-23T12:07:24.510-08:002016-12-23T12:07:24.510-08:00What and whose assertion are you responding to, Da...What and whose assertion are you responding to, Dani?Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-2161499892747637612016-12-23T12:06:10.980-08:002016-12-23T12:06:10.980-08:00That is true.
If that were how "thought prov...That is true.<br /><br />If that were how "thought provoking" were used most often in RPG circles then I would not have had to write this.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-87123271235490885222016-12-23T11:28:49.887-08:002016-12-23T11:28:49.887-08:00But we can read those questions into most media, n...But we can read those questions into most media, not just media that specifically calls it out, and so all media could be "thought-provoking", just as someone could consume media that does explicitly talk about it, say "huh" and move on with their lives without following through on the thinking.<br /><br />Being "thought-provoking" or whatever is a choice the consumer makes, not the artwork (since art doesn't have agency).Danielle Ostermanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05688510764917107213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-52629522978775908252016-12-23T08:15:26.950-08:002016-12-23T08:15:26.950-08:00Fantasy books were a very important part of my for...Fantasy books were a very important part of my formative process, and there are books I would call "thought provoking", not because they give an asnwer that confirms my personal conclusion, but because they do not give answers.<br /><br />In media where tought situations are presented like that, without giving an specific answer, but rather analysing two or more sides without giving an answer as correct,I believe this kind of art can be called thought provoking.<br /><br />CJGeringerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10367654304370593518noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-31788651463951610992016-12-23T01:11:16.217-08:002016-12-23T01:11:16.217-08:00What I liked about rogue 1 was that, at least at t...What I liked about rogue 1 was that, at least at the start before it devolved into an admittedly awesome CGI free for all, it touched on the ethics of the rebellion and fighting for freedom vs doing wrong. That and portraying intrigue amongst the imperial generals. Just gave a few shades of grey to the previously black and white sagas. oh and the cinematography was good too.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11669140271228776459noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-1571398186524377402016-12-22T21:59:33.152-08:002016-12-22T21:59:33.152-08:00The only thing that gives me pause is your use of ...The only thing that gives me pause is your use of the word "unconsidered." Because I think (at least some of) the people *are* considering their use of these useless, lazy words very much. It's not just a blindness to nuance (although sometimes it is), it's a fear of nuance. "From the middle east=terrorist" is easy and clean. Lots of people want their world to be easy and clean. They want to think "well, we've got this terrorist thing all sorted, so we can go back to figuring out what to have for dinner." But bring "religious zealots" into it and someone might start pulling at the thread of "but what about Christian zealots?" and suddenly nothing is simple or clean anymore. And that doesn't let people think about dinner anymore. It doesn't elect candidates or sell toothpaste.<br /><br />To bring it back to your original post, I believe that's why people label things "thought provoking" rather than actually letting their thoughts be provoked. Fear and laziness. People (and I'm obviously generalizing when I say "people" here) want their news, their art, their opinions, and their very view of the world to be able to be quickly digested and easily summarized, and--perhaps most importantly--labeled. <br /><br />To go off on a small tangent, as a writer, I find it astonishing how many others think of their own world (and the work of others) only in terms of labels and strict categories. "This is the scene where X happens," and "this is the scene where Y happens" and X + Y = story. It's like reducing painting to simply paint by numbers. I watched an interesting video called The Epidemic of Passable Movies, and while I don't agree with everything the guy says, I found his point at the end interesting that one commonality of mediocre movies is that the characters don't act like real people would in their situation, they act like characters from other movies would act.<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukk5TJL27pE<br /><br />This is, in my opinion, what happens when even artists resist the idea of nuance in their own work.<br />MonteCookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08154073889172996244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-74999649948703268102016-12-22T17:57:35.318-08:002016-12-22T17:57:35.318-08:00I remember when you asked about supposedly thought...I remember when you asked about supposedly thought-provoking indie rpgs on G+. I was one of those who actually had a thought based on the aforementioned DitV. (You even admitted it was an actual thought at the time. I felt quite accomplished given the other comments I saw, especially regarding the same game.) <br /><br />After reading this article, I am convinced that I was seeking out a special thought to have, simply because I was convinced that there should be one given the hype of the game, mostly from its online fan base. In the end, there's no reason a game of D&D can't raise the same question if it somehow comes about. <br /><br />I also wonder, if Blade Runner lends itself to making me think about questions I already know how I'd answer, then does rewatching it become less valuable? Maybe it's because such questions don't come up in daily life very often, but being reminded of how we'd answer them is of importance to us...? Dan D.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08432627271396472057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-54245419564003527612016-12-22T15:03:22.068-08:002016-12-22T15:03:22.068-08:001. The goal is not to make you think in this case ...1. The goal is not to make you think in this case it's to help people reading you understand what you mean<br /><br />2. If the premise is false in some way that makes it a leading question, you can state why you that is--I can't see what part could possibly be. You can simply type "no" if the premise is simply false, that's why no is an answer.<br />However, you've refused to answer a question above so you're now banned.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-76204312312095670902016-12-22T14:47:30.383-08:002016-12-22T14:47:30.383-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Structured Answerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16099134783225642045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-89853688454257279222016-12-22T14:45:19.295-08:002016-12-22T14:45:19.295-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Structured Answerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16099134783225642045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-87204641343749110552016-12-22T14:40:04.076-08:002016-12-22T14:40:04.076-08:00 I asked you a question
You need to answer questi... I asked you a question<br /><br />You need to answer questions that are asked of you or be banned.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-25387067514104827962016-12-22T14:38:20.588-08:002016-12-22T14:38:20.588-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Structured Answerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16099134783225642045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-59064895045342885992016-12-22T14:20:58.180-08:002016-12-22T14:20:58.180-08:00Ok. But you still need to prove the statement &quo...Ok. But you still need to prove the statement "not everything has meaning".<br /><br />Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-41743858300790940992016-12-22T14:19:35.679-08:002016-12-22T14:19:35.679-08:00Do you think that including or dividing are the on...Do you think that including or dividing are the only possible goals of art?<br /><br />Say yes or noZak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-38902130543613245032016-12-22T14:18:53.069-08:002016-12-22T14:18:53.069-08:00Try to give a better, more articulate answer.
Are...Try to give a better, more articulate answer.<br /><br />Are we asking the freedom fighter/terrorist if THEY have compassion or disdain?<br /><br />Are we asking if we have compassion or disdain for them?<br /><br />etc.<br /><br />And why did you bother to answer this question?Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-63789116352110449062016-12-22T14:18:11.972-08:002016-12-22T14:18:11.972-08:00nihilism doesn't have meaning (no matter how l...nihilism doesn't have meaning (no matter how long you dance around the houses inventing definitions).Structured Answerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16099134783225642045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-27107147074870491972016-12-22T14:13:51.485-08:002016-12-22T14:13:51.485-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Structured Answerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16099134783225642045noreply@blogger.com