tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post3692134726641390072..comments2024-02-29T00:47:06.191-08:00Comments on Playing D&D With Porn Stars: Caves of Chaos Is A One-Page DungeonZak Sabbathhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-30276805310052845462011-09-28T13:20:07.623-07:002011-09-28T13:20:07.623-07:00This format is a nice complement to the Vornheim m...This format is a nice complement to the Vornheim map-plus-facing-one-page-key format. Back in the day, I used to do something like this with the old TSR modules. Those old light blue maps lent themselves to pencilling in notes like this. Not so much the full-color, glossy modern ones. <br /><br />This works especially well for dungeons with different factions/sub-areas. It's easier to keep track of, say, nearby guards that might be alerted and come to join a battle. It gives a useful visual overview of the dungeon "gestalt" and helps the GM see how activity in one area might affect other areas.Matthew Millerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17343263539473683579noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-63094059710446512702011-09-17T12:20:04.606-07:002011-09-17T12:20:04.606-07:00I heartily endorse this format and wish everybody ...I heartily endorse this format and wish everybody used it forever the end.huthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16502682297320819595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-87499277995703545602011-09-16T11:18:26.625-07:002011-09-16T11:18:26.625-07:00Earlier this year my group ran through this very m...Earlier this year my group ran through this very module, with me making changes to fit my own campaign (instead of Chaos priests, they were gunpowder-using Science worshippers, a terrorist group who reject magic) and updated to fit Type III D&D. I think, all told, the group went from 2nd level to 4th level, saw about half of the caves, and spent 7 four or five hour sessions there or the Keep not counting travel time there and back from their home base.<br /><br />My map didn't start out looking like Zak's version, but it sure ended up looking like that. Not color-coded, though. I'll do that with my next dungeon. Very useful, I see.Brian Moonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13454291070572658715noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-28952521034156436712011-09-16T10:17:13.160-07:002011-09-16T10:17:13.160-07:00@kiel
If you wanted to see all of that dungeon (a...@kiel<br /><br />If you wanted to see all of that dungeon (and why would you? there are so many better ones) it would take 4-12 sessions, depending how much fighting vs. sneaking you did and how long the sessions were.<br /><br />Though it does sadden me to hear that this is a big dungeon by recent standards. This is a wee little beastie to me.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-14691884905822165122011-09-16T10:06:51.782-07:002011-09-16T10:06:51.782-07:00Gck!
As a 4e player not used to a lot of the old ...Gck!<br /><br />As a 4e player not used to a lot of the old modules...damn. That's a big dungeon. I know they get progressively bigger...but damn.<br /><br />How many sessions would it take (reasonably) to explore/clear such a thing? Or is that even the point to the adventure? I dunno.Kiel Chenierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15016752327301291104noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-60386471526766921902011-09-16T00:00:05.374-07:002011-09-16T00:00:05.374-07:00I totally didn't know you used that format for...I totally didn't know you used that format for Vornheim. That's hilarious.<br /><br />I do agree with your point though and see your version as a huge step up form the original. Maybe I should track down my own one-page transcription of the Caves. I wonder it I still have it...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05494391031541363595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-42521384465738022252011-09-15T23:30:20.810-07:002011-09-15T23:30:20.810-07:00@lurker
what granary? i am looking at it right no...@lurker<br /><br />what granary? i am looking at it right now. there's no granaryZak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-43424726328174248542011-09-15T23:03:05.886-07:002011-09-15T23:03:05.886-07:00@James:
Look the Keep totally attacked the dwarf&...@James:<br /><br />Look the Keep totally attacked the dwarf's followers first. Just because they were charging tolls or something. And since we had been knighted for saving the Keep from that beholder it was totally uncool for them to throw our henchmen into the prison cells. And then the Keep's commander's mistress stole my elf's magic spurs AND her magic ring AND her magic sword!<br /><br />All I'm saying is the Keep totally had it coming when we sent the war elephant against the front gate and threw those lit flasks of oil into the granary...LurkerWithouthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03540770911478925992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-50885903510529792262011-09-15T20:36:47.568-07:002011-09-15T20:36:47.568-07:00@chandler
my sentiments exactly. If the only thing...@chandler<br />my sentiments exactly. If the only thing in the room is 6 orcs, it shoudn't take longer than it would take me to think of something better to find the 6 orcs in the room.<br /><br />@will douglas<br /><br />got any examples of his work? (especially maps)?Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-87609326825548137332011-09-15T20:33:30.772-07:002011-09-15T20:33:30.772-07:00One of the reasons I never liked modules was havin...One of the reasons I never liked modules was having to sift through all the filler to get to the important stuff. Just easier to make it up via something like you have here on my own.RobChandlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07751057765555584823noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-79970672219279181502011-09-15T20:14:17.672-07:002011-09-15T20:14:17.672-07:00Not sure if it's laziness or lack of vision.
...Not sure if it's laziness or lack of vision. <br /><br />Back in the old SPI, graphic genius Redmond Simonson was a whiz at putting important information on the map. Combat results tables, reinforcement schedules, etc.<br /><br />Sure, that was for wargames, but the principle is the same. Good design is <b>useable</b>; bad design just gets in your way.Will Douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06379173017869751088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-17776044984018584302011-09-15T20:08:34.182-07:002011-09-15T20:08:34.182-07:00(similarly to your graphic, not the advent calenda...(similarly to your graphic, not the advent calendar thing)Chris Goodwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03681832359736521316noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-13644291075802464452011-09-15T20:07:43.294-07:002011-09-15T20:07:43.294-07:00Looking at this gave me a thought. Applicable may...Looking at this gave me a thought. Applicable maybe to this module directly but maybe for other stuff in the future also. <br /><br />What if you were to design something like an advent calendar, with little doors in the dungeon map that open to show you something underneath? Sure, it's totally a gimmick, but I wonder how useful it could be? <br /><br />I think I actually tried to design a few dungeons similarly to this back in the day (meaning like 1983) but didn't have the skills to pull it off.Chris Goodwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03681832359736521316noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-12767192200451796232011-09-15T17:15:22.201-07:002011-09-15T17:15:22.201-07:00Excellent and inspiring post Zak. I can see the va...Excellent and inspiring post Zak. I can see the value of combining this style of map with the traditional module. It would make for a flexible product that took into account the referee's level of confidence/ability - or in other words the confident ref could just go with the map, others may lean on the module a bit more.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-88967696055132876482011-09-15T17:03:04.862-07:002011-09-15T17:03:04.862-07:00@crom
yep@crom<br /><br />yepZak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-34307145633338191402011-09-15T16:49:20.121-07:002011-09-15T16:49:20.121-07:00I make it 50% lazy, 50% page count to justify pric...I make it 50% lazy, 50% page count to justify price point.<br /><br />Nobody is going to pay $10 for that. Even though it's way more gameable than the 32 page version.<br /><br />Remember DCC's adventure on a card format from 3e? Those were $2 IIRC.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-76892507298698069062011-09-15T16:09:39.558-07:002011-09-15T16:09:39.558-07:00@Ian
Ah, the Vornheim format! I'm somewhat fa...@Ian<br /><br />Ah, the Vornheim format! I'm somewhat familiar with it.<br /><br />Point is: there's better ways to do it than what they sell us.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-75878558946058635982011-09-15T16:01:16.644-07:002011-09-15T16:01:16.644-07:00That encounter with a dozen skeletons is a hella-l...That encounter with a dozen skeletons is a hella-lot more fun with 40 or 50 skeletons. Sure the "surprise" in the other room with a bunch of undead doesnt' seem as cool but man oh man a bunch of low level undead is a fun fight with no moral ambiguity and no mercy.JDJarvishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07691101939920824546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-71692749518369071012011-09-15T16:00:53.892-07:002011-09-15T16:00:53.892-07:00Personally, I prefer the one page of text + one pa...Personally, I prefer the one page of text + one page of map format I've been working with for the last month. There just isn't quite enough detail there to jog my memory of what happened in what room from session to session if the PCs come back.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05494391031541363595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-20775467461646219762011-09-15T15:45:51.291-07:002011-09-15T15:45:51.291-07:00*Fucking owlbear*
Probably the best label I have ...*Fucking owlbear*<br /><br />Probably the best label I have ever read off a map. <br /><br />This is incredibly useful. I was never able to remember which freakin cave had what in it.Piercehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17342275462566805167noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-49273029133883759112011-09-15T15:29:56.525-07:002011-09-15T15:29:56.525-07:00The Keep is actually a more interesting target to ...The Keep is actually a more interesting target to me, as a DM--none of this "ascending-hit-die-petting-zoo" business. But I did the caves because it looked harder and I had a point to prove.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-80844183016466885842011-09-15T15:29:14.198-07:002011-09-15T15:29:14.198-07:00Cool! I'd been doing this sort of thing in my ...Cool! I'd been doing this sort of thing in my games - T1's moathouse for example. It had never occurred to me that the format was a one page dungeon.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-57474372588471309042011-09-15T15:29:09.272-07:002011-09-15T15:29:09.272-07:00Very interesting. This is definitely putting your ...Very interesting. This is definitely putting your mapping where your mouth is.John Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17813593224618572349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2638993969706011706.post-33925049498644080972011-09-15T15:28:12.853-07:002011-09-15T15:28:12.853-07:00Some PC's, somewhere, are gonna want to attack...Some PC's, somewhere, are gonna want to attack the keep...<br /><br />:)Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08192212467523179768noreply@blogger.com